WEBVTT NOTE This file was generated by Descript 00:00:02.190 --> 00:00:06.750 Annette: Hello and welcome to the Tiny Cafe. 00:00:07.170 --> 00:00:13.350 I'm Annette Wernblad and I am an expert on stories and myths and archetypes, and one 00:00:13.350 --> 00:00:18.360 of my favorite things in the entire world is explaining to people how these things 00:00:18.360 --> 00:00:23.895 can very much transform our lives if we learn to pay attention and understand 00:00:23.895 --> 00:00:26.085 what they're really trying to tell us. 00:00:26.195 --> 00:00:31.085 I am also the creator of the Art of Living Deliberately Virtual Cafe. 00:00:31.085 --> 00:00:35.165 And what this is, the Tiny Cafe, is what I call the espresso 00:00:35.170 --> 00:00:37.445 version of, the virtual cafe. 00:00:38.175 --> 00:00:41.875 Is that in the, in the virtual cafe, we meet for 90 minutes. 00:00:41.905 --> 00:00:45.895 And here in the tiny cafe, we just meet for the length of what it takes. 00:00:46.015 --> 00:00:50.095 If you are seated in a lovely Parisian cafe with an espresso, 00:00:50.335 --> 00:00:55.465 So every Thursday, as some of you know, I post a question on I. 00:00:56.105 --> 00:01:00.725 And then on Saturdays I go live in the tiny cafe and talk to you about the 00:01:00.725 --> 00:01:03.665 question and the answers and my comments 00:01:03.765 --> 00:01:09.855 . So the question I asked this week was, which of these two songwriters in your 00:01:09.855 --> 00:01:12.935 opinion, writes the deepest stories? 00:01:13.355 --> 00:01:14.105 Bruce Springsteen? 00:01:15.195 --> 00:01:20.895 Leonard Cohen and I actually thought , I'm not exactly sure why I thought that, 00:01:21.105 --> 00:01:24.765 but I actually thought that Leonard Cohen was just gonna win straight out. 00:01:25.155 --> 00:01:29.995 But it turned out that it was a 50 50 split and for the longest time, Bruce 00:01:29.995 --> 00:01:32.005 Spring Springsteen was actually ahead. 00:01:32.245 --> 00:01:38.015 So what I'm gonna be talking to you about today, what, why did I ask that question? 00:01:38.015 --> 00:01:39.905 And what do the answers mean? 00:01:40.655 --> 00:01:47.225 How and why is it that song lyrics by the great songwriters 00:01:47.465 --> 00:01:49.325 can actually change our lives? 00:01:49.545 --> 00:01:51.045 What, what is it that they do? 00:01:51.125 --> 00:01:55.475 And why is that so potentially transformative if we learn 00:01:55.475 --> 00:01:57.215 to, to really pay attention. 00:01:57.405 --> 00:01:59.535 So let's start with Bruce Springsteen. 00:02:00.025 --> 00:02:04.605 And I'm just gonna take one example out of hundreds and hundreds of songs , and 00:02:04.605 --> 00:02:07.515 this is a song called Highway Patrolman. 00:02:08.355 --> 00:02:10.245 And it starts with these lines. 00:02:11.520 --> 00:02:13.290 My name is Joe Roberts. 00:02:13.470 --> 00:02:14.760 I work for the state. 00:02:15.330 --> 00:02:19.020 I'm a sergeant out of Perryville Barracks, number eight. 00:02:19.710 --> 00:02:24.210 I always did an honest job, as honest as I could, but I got a 00:02:24.210 --> 00:02:27.060 brother named Frankie and Frankie. 00:02:27.060 --> 00:02:27.690 Ain't no good. 00:02:29.670 --> 00:02:33.840 And I love these opening lines because straight away he does what, 00:02:33.960 --> 00:02:36.030 what Springsteen so typically does. 00:02:36.080 --> 00:02:40.010 Is that Springsteen tells us very straight ahead stories 00:02:40.190 --> 00:02:42.160 that actually contain very deep. 00:02:42.785 --> 00:02:44.495 Archetypal levels. 00:02:44.825 --> 00:02:46.685 So what is it that he's saying with this? 00:02:46.685 --> 00:02:52.195 Well, he's touching upon one of the oldest and deepest stories known to mankind, 00:02:52.405 --> 00:02:54.535 which you might sort of boil it down to. 00:02:55.075 --> 00:02:58.945 Once upon a time there was a man who had two sons. 00:03:00.040 --> 00:03:01.090 , do you know that story? 00:03:01.660 --> 00:03:05.680 Because I, I think it is so fascinating that just those lines, once upon a 00:03:05.680 --> 00:03:08.470 time there was a man who had two sons. 00:03:08.470 --> 00:03:12.520 It's a completely different story from once upon a time, there 00:03:12.520 --> 00:03:14.230 was a man who had three sons. 00:03:14.410 --> 00:03:17.530 And what I'm saying that it's an archetypal story. 00:03:17.650 --> 00:03:20.440 What I really mean is that it touches us on really. 00:03:21.250 --> 00:03:26.790 Um, unconscious and subconscious levels, whether we're aware of it or not. 00:03:26.790 --> 00:03:30.390 But if we learn to read this consciously, we can actually 00:03:30.390 --> 00:03:32.310 start using it in our lives. 00:03:32.340 --> 00:03:35.095 Instead of it using us, 00:03:35.145 --> 00:03:36.375 this is one of, I am mottos. 00:03:36.435 --> 00:03:39.795 If you don't run with a wolf, the wolf will run with you. 00:03:40.095 --> 00:03:43.275 So let's just take a closer look at just that one story. 00:03:43.275 --> 00:03:46.845 And I could have taken anyone of, of most of Bruce Springsteen's 00:03:46.845 --> 00:03:48.675 songs and done the same thing. 00:03:49.515 --> 00:03:50.445 What does that mean? 00:03:50.445 --> 00:03:51.225 That story? 00:03:51.495 --> 00:03:53.355 Once upon a time, there was a man. 00:03:54.285 --> 00:03:55.125 two sons. 00:03:55.395 --> 00:03:59.625 Well, it touches upon one of the basic archetypes that Carl Young, the Swiss 00:03:59.625 --> 00:04:07.365 psychologist talks about, which is what we call the archetype, the hostile brothers. 00:04:08.205 --> 00:04:09.675 So we straightaway know. 00:04:09.680 --> 00:04:10.365 Isn't that true? 00:04:10.365 --> 00:04:14.265 I mean, if you think about it, there was a man, he had two sons straight away. 00:04:14.265 --> 00:04:19.815 We know that the typical structure of that story is that one of those two sons, 00:04:20.850 --> 00:04:25.740 Um, a good man, a straight man, an honest man who was prepared to spend his life 00:04:25.740 --> 00:04:27.990 walking in the footsteps of his father. 00:04:29.100 --> 00:04:33.360 The other man was the brother named Frankie. 00:04:33.365 --> 00:04:34.590 And Frankie ain't no good. 00:04:35.370 --> 00:04:39.720 And I think part of the pain of that song is which of those two sons 00:04:39.720 --> 00:04:44.700 does the father really actually, The most, and the answer usually 00:04:44.700 --> 00:04:48.570 is that he likes the bad kid better than the good, straight, honest kid. 00:04:48.630 --> 00:04:52.560 And that means, so we're, if we're asking ourselves why does that 00:04:52.560 --> 00:04:54.870 story, how does it concern me? 00:04:55.030 --> 00:05:00.125 I'm not a man who has two sons or, or perhaps even, I'm not even a son. 00:05:00.125 --> 00:05:03.765 I may be a daughter, or whatever it is that we have as objections. 00:05:03.945 --> 00:05:07.725 Well, the thing about archetypes , archetypes have very old, ancient. 00:05:08.125 --> 00:05:11.725 Delivered through generations to our subconscious. 00:05:11.725 --> 00:05:15.805 I mean, Young's theory, and I'll explain more about that some other day, that 00:05:15.805 --> 00:05:21.865 Young's theory was that we all have, when we're born, a knowledge of the archetypes. 00:05:22.015 --> 00:05:24.655 So if we just look at that story and we can look at that story of 00:05:24.655 --> 00:05:31.225 the hostile brothers in different ways, is that we all know the pain, 00:05:31.285 --> 00:05:34.615 I think of being that oldest son. 00:05:35.200 --> 00:05:41.400 Who is very beautiful and living up to all expectations and willing to 00:05:41.400 --> 00:05:45.690 just almost give up our own lives to walk in the footsteps of the parent, 00:05:46.290 --> 00:05:48.270 but the parent prefers the other one. 00:05:48.270 --> 00:05:54.140 So that's just like one level of, archetypal deeply, ingrained knowledge. 00:05:54.240 --> 00:05:57.720 That pain of the parent preferring the other one. 00:05:59.475 --> 00:06:04.245 The other level , what is the, that archetype, the, the hostile brothers, 00:06:04.555 --> 00:06:06.205 what does that archetype mean? 00:06:06.595 --> 00:06:13.455 One of the things Jung says, is somewhere we all have a frightful horrible brother. 00:06:14.460 --> 00:06:19.830 And the more we try to hide things we don't want people to know, the more we 00:06:19.830 --> 00:06:25.320 try to hide those things under the table, the more pleasure that brother takes 00:06:25.320 --> 00:06:27.570 in putting those things on the table. 00:06:28.020 --> 00:06:31.760 And now it's sort of touching upon another union. 00:06:32.080 --> 00:06:34.450 Archetypes, the one that's called the shadow. 00:06:34.660 --> 00:06:38.980 The idea that we have the one brother, we, we contain both 00:06:38.980 --> 00:06:41.040 brothers . My name is Joe Roberts. 00:06:41.040 --> 00:06:42.150 I work for the state. 00:06:42.180 --> 00:06:45.810 I've always done an honest job, but I got got a brother named Frankie. 00:06:45.810 --> 00:06:49.560 And Frankie ain't no good that we contain both those things. 00:06:49.560 --> 00:06:53.185 , we contain both those brothers, whether we are women or men. 00:06:53.465 --> 00:06:54.495 And that has to do with the. 00:06:55.375 --> 00:07:00.405 and the idea that we have, , that's Nathaniel Hoor says in the Scarlet 00:07:00.405 --> 00:07:04.365 Letter, we have one face that we show to the world, and then we have another 00:07:04.365 --> 00:07:06.555 face that we don't show to anyone. 00:07:06.555 --> 00:07:10.945 And that's the other very, very powerful aspect of that archetype that. 00:07:11.565 --> 00:07:15.945 also, we all know, you know, I sometimes use this analogy saying, how would 00:07:15.945 --> 00:07:20.295 you, how do we know when that brother Frankie, who ain't no good, how do we 00:07:20.295 --> 00:07:22.035 know when he's playing tricks on us? 00:07:22.040 --> 00:07:25.245 And, and as again, as I said, if you don't play with Frankie, 00:07:25.245 --> 00:07:27.255 Frankie is gonna play with you. 00:07:27.645 --> 00:07:30.275 That we all, know that, somebody's really annoying to us. 00:07:30.275 --> 00:07:33.695 And if we've had like one beer or too many, or, or if we're particularly 00:07:33.695 --> 00:07:37.265 sensitive and something happens and then we snap back at that person 00:07:37.505 --> 00:07:41.555 when we really didn't mean to, and we really shouldn't have, and it 00:07:41.560 --> 00:07:42.995 would've been much better not to. 00:07:42.995 --> 00:07:46.445 And the next day we call up mother-in-law saying, I'm sorry I snapped at you. 00:07:46.445 --> 00:07:47.465 I didn't really mean it. 00:07:47.525 --> 00:07:51.545 And the thing is, yes you did, but you didn't mean to say it and you shouldn't. 00:07:52.280 --> 00:07:53.630 . And that's, that's the other thing. 00:07:53.630 --> 00:07:56.960 So how does it transform our lives to listen to a Bruce 00:07:56.960 --> 00:07:58.340 Springsteen song like that? 00:07:58.610 --> 00:08:02.920 Well, that, whether we're aware of it or not, these deeply archetypal 00:08:02.925 --> 00:08:09.690 stories touch that, , level of our unconscious and subconscious mind that 00:08:09.690 --> 00:08:15.905 we don't have normally direct access to, but that, Do have direct access to. 00:08:16.115 --> 00:08:20.525 So that's the why, why do stories potentially transform our lives 00:08:20.525 --> 00:08:22.475 if we stop and listen to them. 00:08:22.525 --> 00:08:26.475 The other question, and now want to go into Leonard Cohen 00:08:27.435 --> 00:08:33.205 if I were to, say as briefly as possible, what is the, biggest difference between 00:08:33.925 --> 00:08:36.235 Bruce Springsteen and Leonard Cohen? 00:08:36.565 --> 00:08:41.065 I would say this, that Springsteen's stories of easily understood. 00:08:41.365 --> 00:08:44.575 , they're symbolic in a way that, that you know the story they 00:08:44.575 --> 00:08:48.145 tell on the surface level, we can all understand what he's saying. 00:08:48.145 --> 00:08:50.455 I have a brother named Frankie and Frankie no good. 00:08:50.935 --> 00:08:53.245 But then it contains those deeper levels. 00:08:53.665 --> 00:08:58.075 Leonard Cohen's lyrics are much harder to understand because Leonard Cohen 00:08:58.080 --> 00:09:02.590 very often communicates in metaphors, and that means that things may. 00:09:03.015 --> 00:09:06.975 Necessarily mean what they represent, they may mean something else, and we have to 00:09:07.155 --> 00:09:12.285 decode them in order to get to the deeper layers of what they mean those metaphors. 00:09:12.475 --> 00:09:16.885 I think all of Leonard Cohen's songs are about a potential transformation 00:09:16.885 --> 00:09:19.345 of human consciousness in general. 00:09:19.625 --> 00:09:24.075 He comes from obviously the Jewish tradition where, I think that it, 00:09:24.075 --> 00:09:28.815 it's useful sometimes with Cohen songs to, to almost see them as prayers. 00:09:29.625 --> 00:09:31.695 They're sacred works in a way. 00:09:32.355 --> 00:09:35.145 I think, if I ask people, do you know Leonard Cohen? 00:09:35.145 --> 00:09:38.290 And if they don't particularly know Leonard Cohen, the line that 00:09:38.320 --> 00:09:41.350 everybody always quotes back is there's a crack in everything. 00:09:41.350 --> 00:09:44.380 That's how the light gets in, which is I think, a very 00:09:44.380 --> 00:09:46.480 moving, line from a very moving. 00:09:47.695 --> 00:09:50.935 which actually if you, we had all the time in the world if we were in 00:09:50.935 --> 00:09:54.655 the real virtual cafe, I would go into depth with that particular song 00:09:54.775 --> 00:09:58.765 Anthem, because it is, I think, very appropriate for the time we're in now 00:09:58.765 --> 00:10:01.945 coming out of a very difficult period. 00:10:02.425 --> 00:10:06.445 The other thing that people possibly know is Larry Cohen's song called 00:10:06.445 --> 00:10:10.855 Hallelujah, which in my opinion, and I hope I'm not offending anyone, I 00:10:10.855 --> 00:10:14.815 think it has been butchered to death almost by all those people doing 00:10:14.815 --> 00:10:17.035 cover versions, and it's very clear. 00:10:17.065 --> 00:10:17.635 Strangely enough. 00:10:18.360 --> 00:10:22.530 That those people abbreviate it because it's a very long song, that 00:10:22.530 --> 00:10:25.320 they, they don't really understand what it's about because it's a, it's 00:10:25.320 --> 00:10:27.270 a very depressing song actually. 00:10:27.270 --> 00:10:28.650 So people use it for all these things. 00:10:28.650 --> 00:10:31.660 Even Donald Trump, used it for his inauguration. 00:10:31.660 --> 00:10:34.160 And Larry Collins Estate had to sue because, you're not 00:10:34.160 --> 00:10:35.780 allowed to just play that song. 00:10:35.930 --> 00:10:38.750 But obviously he didn't understand what that song was about. 00:10:38.750 --> 00:10:43.970 It's a very difficult and painful song about spiritual agony and 00:10:43.970 --> 00:10:47.660 it ends with the, I think, some of the most beautiful lines. 00:10:48.140 --> 00:10:52.900 And even though it all went wrong, I'll stand before the Lord of Song 00:10:53.080 --> 00:10:55.630 with nothing on my tongue, but Halle. 00:10:57.185 --> 00:11:01.295 to me that's so moving, even though it all went wrong, I'll stand before the 00:11:01.335 --> 00:11:04.185 Lord of Song with nothing on my tongue. 00:11:04.845 --> 00:11:05.505 But hallelu, 00:11:05.505 --> 00:11:06.495 it's about gratitude. 00:11:06.495 --> 00:11:07.605 It's about redemption. 00:11:07.755 --> 00:11:10.200 It's about going through that dark, dark agony. 00:11:11.205 --> 00:11:17.725 And of course, I think also Cohen's lyrics or darker than, Bruce Springsteen's 00:11:18.035 --> 00:11:20.495 And, and let me just take this one level. 00:11:21.720 --> 00:11:24.950 Ask people who are some of your other favorite, the really 00:11:24.950 --> 00:11:28.070 brilliant songwriters and people came up with these wonderful things. 00:11:28.070 --> 00:11:31.880 Johnny Cash, Tom Whites Pink, Chris Christofferson. 00:11:31.910 --> 00:11:34.520 I was wondering that nobody came up with probably the 00:11:34.520 --> 00:11:36.620 greatest of them all, Bob Dylan. 00:11:36.980 --> 00:11:39.870 But what I'm, I'm saying now applies to all of them. 00:11:41.580 --> 00:11:47.660 How then can you use, ? How exactly can you use those songs by those wonderful 00:11:47.660 --> 00:11:53.060 songwriters to transform your life in a way that you can feel instantly? 00:11:55.775 --> 00:12:02.705 We have a tendency when we use art, when we view or listen to or read 00:12:02.705 --> 00:12:06.005 art, we have a tendency to almost. 00:12:06.500 --> 00:12:09.260 Binge like we do when we watch Netflix. 00:12:09.260 --> 00:12:12.290 We don't like watch one episode and then stop and really 00:12:12.530 --> 00:12:13.880 feel it and think about it. 00:12:14.000 --> 00:12:19.130 We watch 10,000 episodes and if with music we have a playlist and sometimes 00:12:19.130 --> 00:12:23.360 it's even on random and and we are letting, like one of these programs we 00:12:23.360 --> 00:12:27.560 use for streaming music despite the order of the music and we just have it in the 00:12:27.560 --> 00:12:32.550 background, we're multitasking, which is, you know, slogan in my cafe and everywhere 00:12:32.550 --> 00:12:34.800 is the art of living deliberately. 00:12:35.070 --> 00:12:38.220 So multitasking is the opposite of living deliberately. 00:12:38.220 --> 00:12:40.350 You cannot have both of those things. 00:12:40.560 --> 00:12:43.320 So we are doing something else and we have music playing in the background, 00:12:43.320 --> 00:12:44.940 and that music may be Bob Dylan. 00:12:44.940 --> 00:12:47.280 It may be the most brilliant lyric ever written. 00:12:47.880 --> 00:12:51.180 But the thing is, if you want to learn to use. 00:12:52.380 --> 00:12:55.890 You can, you can apply this to movies and television series and all the books 00:12:55.890 --> 00:12:57.390 and all the other things I talk about. 00:12:57.390 --> 00:12:59.340 My . You can use that as well. 00:12:59.520 --> 00:13:01.650 But let's just stay with music for the time being. 00:13:02.190 --> 00:13:10.020 If you want to, learn to use music to transform your life, do it deliberately. 00:13:10.290 --> 00:13:11.700 Do it consciously. 00:13:11.880 --> 00:13:16.740 Take one song, listen to that song, and I'm gonna give you a song just to, 00:13:16.740 --> 00:13:19.350 you know, as an exercise, play that. 00:13:20.190 --> 00:13:22.620 Really, really listen to the lyrics. 00:13:22.650 --> 00:13:26.790 Maybe after you've listened to it a few times, you can find the lyrics on ghoul or 00:13:26.790 --> 00:13:31.710 something else and, and, and read the, the lyrics too, but just try to listen to it 00:13:31.710 --> 00:13:34.020 the way it was supposed to be experienced. 00:13:34.425 --> 00:13:37.755 Listen to that song and really just stay with that song. 00:13:37.785 --> 00:13:41.475 Don't find a gazillion other songs, songs by the same songwriter because 00:13:41.475 --> 00:13:42.795 you think this was a good one. 00:13:43.005 --> 00:13:47.505 Stay with it and really, really take it in and listen to what it's saying. 00:13:47.535 --> 00:13:52.245 And the song I'm going to give you, as an example, is a song by Leonard 00:13:52.245 --> 00:13:55.035 Cohen, uh, which is called Come. 00:13:56.565 --> 00:14:00.455 I . It is a song that again, that I think is very, very appropriate and 00:14:00.455 --> 00:14:04.085 timely for the period we're in now because it is about, and I'm gonna just 00:14:04.085 --> 00:14:05.795 gonna read you a few lines from it. 00:14:06.155 --> 00:14:09.155 It is about coming out of pain. 00:14:10.105 --> 00:14:13.555 and processing that pain and starting the healing 00:14:13.655 --> 00:14:13.895 . I think. 00:14:14.370 --> 00:14:18.600 because Leonard Cohen, if you look at, at his works in, in their entirety, 00:14:19.100 --> 00:14:22.840 they're really meant to transform the consciousness of mankind , to 00:14:22.840 --> 00:14:24.310 something deeper and better. 00:14:24.310 --> 00:14:26.290 I always say you, we can't decide. 00:14:26.290 --> 00:14:27.370 Life is so short. 00:14:27.640 --> 00:14:30.520 We don't know how long our life is gonna be, but we can 00:14:30.520 --> 00:14:32.140 decide how deep it's gonna be. 00:14:32.170 --> 00:14:35.800 And I think Leonard Cohen is one of the people who was very 00:14:35.890 --> 00:14:37.530 much, aware of these things. 00:14:37.650 --> 00:14:42.050 So anyway, this is a song called Come Healing, and this is how it starts. 00:14:43.220 --> 00:14:46.370 Oh, gather up the brokenness and bring it to me. 00:14:46.370 --> 00:14:51.890 Now, the fragrance of those promises you never dared to bow the splinters 00:14:51.890 --> 00:14:56.000 that you carry, the cross you left behind come healing of the 00:14:56.000 --> 00:14:58.340 body, come healing of the mind. 00:14:59.450 --> 00:15:02.660 And I almost can't, I mean, I can't listen to that song without crying and I'm 00:15:02.660 --> 00:15:05.330 almost tearing up now come healing of the. 00:15:06.080 --> 00:15:07.340 come Healing of the Mind. 00:15:07.340 --> 00:15:11.690 And this song, as I said, it is a prayer and it's song like an anthem 00:15:12.140 --> 00:15:16.320 and , so your homework, I don't usually give homework in the tiny cafe. 00:15:16.650 --> 00:15:21.940 Your homework is to, find that song come healing, and listen to that song and just 00:15:21.940 --> 00:15:26.170 stay with that one song for as long as you can and see if you can feel, I, you 00:15:26.170 --> 00:15:31.640 know, I, I dare you to not feel how it, it , transforms you to listen to that song. 00:15:31.970 --> 00:15:34.515 So the, the big trick to how is it that art. 00:15:34.870 --> 00:15:38.140 Or it can transform our lives, is don't binge it. 00:15:38.350 --> 00:15:41.170 Don't binge watch it, don't play it in the background. 00:15:41.570 --> 00:15:43.970 , don't multitask while you're experiencing it. 00:15:44.485 --> 00:15:48.145 You know, if you go to a museum, look at the paintings instead of taking 00:15:48.145 --> 00:15:50.125 pictures of you looking at the paintings. 00:15:50.215 --> 00:15:51.235 You know what I mean by that. 00:15:51.865 --> 00:15:56.085 So that was all for today and, thank you so much for being here and for 00:15:56.555 --> 00:16:01.905 watching this, and I hope that you have a really great evening or afternoon, 00:16:01.905 --> 00:16:03.255 wherever you are in the world. 00:16:03.675 --> 00:16:04.515 Thank you.